#0 · Apr 15, 2005, 00:52 · Shzarnie
1. My base chakra seems not to be doing anything when I try and activate them, what can I do to fix this? And, a few days ago, my brow chakra was active all day, it kept tickling me. I thought I had a hair on my forehead but whenever I went to brush it away, nothing was there. Why did this happen?
2. Does anyone know of a way to get the vibes? I can't seem to get any at all no matter how hard I try or don't try.
3. FoCs, Frank, just how many are there? And I don't really understand the f2oC, f3oC, f4oC, what are they, what do they do, and how do you get there?
Sorry about the breaking of the rules again, and about the odd sounding post but I've had to change some things, read the post in member intros, it's all explained!
Shzarnie
#1 · Apr 18, 2005, 01:19 · Andali27
Andali
#2 · Apr 18, 2005, 01:21 · Shzarnie
?
Shzarnie
#3 · Apr 18, 2005, 01:53 · knightlight
#4 · Apr 18, 2005, 02:18 · Ben K
(no joke, it works for me, but im a male and you know we are all apes that think about nothing but sex every 30 seconds or whatever, haha)
2. Have you tried phasing? When you phase there is no "vibes" or exit sensations of any kind. And once you phase to the astral you can go right back to the RTZ if you want.
3. This might be a long one and i dont know if i have all this information correct, but ive been reading alot. ALOT.
There are FOUR Focuses. F1 Is the physical, everyday focus. C1 in monroes model. F2oC is the area set aside just for your personal use. This is also the 3d darkness everyone talks about. This is also where memory is stored. You put images onto a blank "canvas" in your area of F2oC and you can recall them later. This is where we do most of our dreaming.
F3oC Is where there are actual entities. This is 21-26 or something in monroes models. It holds all the BST(belief system territories) where people go after they "die" in the physical. There, people participate in whatever belief construct they subscribed to in life. Heaven, Hell, etc. etc. I think it is only the fundamentalists that arrive here, so chances are if you even reading these boards you are safe ;)Also, people are here who do not know they have passed on and continue to live normal lives in there own constructs.
F4oC is a place where you are nothing but a point of consciousness, and there are no constructs that apply here. So any concept you can think of, you can not only participate, but you can become. So you can, for instance, become the concept of music. Im not really sure how this works, as i havent even projected yet =\
To get to these seperate areas all you have to do is shift your awareness. This is where the whole concept of phasing comes in. You merely shift your awareness from F1oC to F2oC. This holds many pros compared to the typical OBE, like much better memory retention, since you arent "copying" your whole body. You are the same person, same concsious state, just a different environment. You become aware of these other focuses of conscioussnes.
Yawn...g, night
Ben
#5 · Apr 18, 2005, 07:48 · alexd
The base chakra can be activated easily with certain sitting positions such as yoga.
Visualization also works well, but I have heard that not many people have success with it.
Also just using mobile body awareness can be at times enough to activate it.
And Ben: It is a common misperception that the base chakra is associated with sexual energy, the second chakra just below your tummy is associated with sexuality and emotions.
Alex
#6 · Apr 18, 2005, 17:14 · Frank
I'm sorry but I always avoid "chakra talk" as there are just too many belief constructs attached and it all gets a bit messy. Almost like a religion you might say. Where the original idea was kinda good but the whole message has long-since been lost.
There are 4 primary areas of consciousness in our system, labelled F1 to F4 inclusive. I've talked a lot about these the past few weeks in answer to members questions. So please look up my previous posts and I'm sure you'll get some info that will be of interest.
I'm not sure why you are trying to attain a vibrational state in particular. It is simply not necessary. Plus, we all go through these dry spells once in a while, especially when we are first setting out.
Yours,
Frank
#7 · Apr 18, 2005, 18:20 · Ben K
Quote from: alexd Just regarding your first question:Ah okay, well whatever that one is, the way i described is DEFINITELY the way to go if you want to feel some funky energy in your groin area!
The base chakra can be activated easily with certain sitting positions such as yoga.
Visualization also works well, but I have heard that not many people have success with it.
Also just using mobile body awareness can be at times enough to activate it.
And Ben: It is a common misperception that the base chakra is associated with sexual energy, the second chakra just below your tummy is associated with sexuality and emotions.
Alex
#8 · Apr 18, 2005, 18:49 · Andali27
Question: to engage f2oC, you have to engage the physical senses, without moving or whatever (of course, that would kill whatever you try to do), engaging them inside your mind? Correct? I just wanna get all this down cause I'm in the process of starting over from the beginning, breaking down all the expectations I've come to have about phasing and whatnot. From there I hope to have a fresh start without the belief constructs holding me down.
Andali
#9 · Apr 18, 2005, 19:46 · Frank
One of the main reasons I wanted to write the book is because a lot of the info I'm publishing on the forum is becoming fragmented. So people don't quite know which bit fits where. In the book it's all integrated so you can follow it easier.
Monroe was the first person, to my knowledge, who discovered that these areas of consciousness are not places, as traditional mystics had previously assumed... they are focuses of attention.
On that basis, he created a model of consciousness that has become known as the Monroe linear-focus model. It starts at C1, which is the physical, then F3, F10, F12, F15, F21, F23-24-25-26 & F27. Much later on there came an F35 but it's a bit whacky for words, so I tend to forget that one.
My Phasing Model is loosely based on the Monroe model. My F1oC is Monroe C1. Monroe F3 to F21 inclusive is my F2oC. But please note the Monroe model does not translate too well in this respect, which is one of the reasons why I developed a new model in the first place. My F3 is Monroe F21 to F27 inclusive. These translate pretty much exact. My F4 of consciousness has no direct translation with the Monroe model, which is the other main reason why I came to develop my own model of consciousness.
Briefly, to make the initial shift to F2oC you start the Noticing exercise, which gets you looking within you. Once you get the hang of doing that, you start creating a mental rundown. This is a series of mental images. It can be anything you enjoy, apart from the obvious, i.e. sex. Reason being this engages the physical also, which you do not want. Well, it does with men in an obvious way. :)
You are beyond the Noticing exercise stage so start with the rundown. The Noticing exercise is for complete beginners.
When you start your mental rundown, it will appear as if you are looking at yourself in mind from a distance. This is what I call 3rd-person view. During your rundown, you should engage your senses within the rundown as much as possible. In other words, don't just try to "see" but touch, taste, smell, feel... as much as you can. It's not easy but work on trying as much as you can. The more you engage your senses the more likely you will reach the next stage, as follows...
At some point, you get what I call, "the switch".
This is where you will switch from third-person, looking-at-a-distance to actually viewing what you were previously imagining as a first-person view. In other words, it'll be like it's you, Andali, looking out of your own eyes in your own body, but your environment will have changed. Note: when I say your own body, I don't mean your actual physical body. But it will be a replica of your physical and it will feel like your physical body in all respects.
Once you make the switch, you are now within Focus 2 of consciousness. (According to the Phasing Model that is.) As I say, there is no direct correlation to the Monroe Model. Once you are within F2oC you then decide where you want to go. You can have a look around where you are, or shift to another area, it's entirely up to you. I posted the technique of shifting areas from F2 to F3 just recently. Do a search on slat-effect and that should bring up the post.
If you want to move to F3oC then I would advise you to seek out the 3D Blackness, which is at the "border" between F2 and F3. This you have come across before so you should recognise it again.
Best of luck!
Yours,
Frank
#10 · Apr 18, 2005, 21:47 · Andali27
One question, when you refer to the 3rd person to 1st person switch, let me see if I can put this into words. When I visualise, I usually try to see things out of my own eyes, 1st person, but, then there's a kind of distance in the visualisation. I feel further back from the first person view, but still tring to see things from my own eyes though I don't get full 1st person view.
Um, this may not make too much sense, but are you referring to 3rd person as this detached-distance feeling that's not a full 1st person? Unless you mean to imagine yourself walking or whatever, feeling yourself, 5 senses, from the outside?
Sorry about teh clarity in this, but can you clarify the 3rd/1st thing please?
Andali
#11 · Apr 18, 2005, 21:52 · Shzarnie
Shzarnie
#12 · Apr 19, 2005, 00:42 · Frank
I'm not sure if you picked it up, but I just noticed I made a typo in my previous post. I said my F2oC is up to F15. It's not, it's up to F21. I'll nip back in a moment to edit that.
When I use the term "border", I tend to put it in double quotes because I use the term loosely. The 3D Blackness is not really a border, as such, but it can be thought of that way. Just as I often think of the RTZ being a kind of border between F1 and F2. It's not really. In the Phasing model the RTZ is F1 and the 3D Blackness is F2. But they are right on the "edge" of these areas, so to speak. And because of the nature of them being at the "edge", they can be thought of as a border. (But only in a manner of speaking, of course.)
I concluded that the 3D Blackness is situated in the place that I suggest from my own empirical analysis. According to the Phasing Model of consciousness, if you are within the 3D Blackness then you are already at F2. Now, what is difficult is actually trying to, in some way, "sub map" F2. I find the area just so responsive to thoughts, beliefs, and whatnot, I just can't any definites I can latch onto as pointers. In F3 it's different as you are dealing with other people who are "separate" from you. So this enables you to make an objective analysis and catalogue various actions in common. This is what Monroe did, of course, and why we now have a number of sub-focuses for this area and none elsewhere; because it's really the only inner area that you can "objectively map".
Between Focus10 and Focus 21 of the Monroe model there is a region that in my Phasing Model is the guts of F2. If you think of Monroe F10 at one edge of F2oC as a whole, with Monroe's F21 at the other, in the middle are the "guts" of it, so to speak. But my saying "in the middle" I'm not trying to imply Focus 15. Unfortunately, there is a large lump of consciousness that simply doesn't relate to the Monroe Model. I think I have mentioned to you before that translate it into what I call a wider Focus 12.
Anyhow, when people make what I call "the switch" that's where they typically end up, in their imagination. This is kind-of slap-bang in the middle of F2oC that I translate into Monroe terms, as the notion of a wider Focus 12.
For some reason Monroe left this area out. I suppose he did it for good reason as this region of consciousness (traditionally the Astral) has been a major source of misunderstanding in the past. Plus, there is no reason why you can't sort-of skip past the guts of F2, in other words only entertain a traditional, more narrowly defined Focus 12, and proceed directly to the 3D Blackness at Monroe F21... which is basically what you are doing it sounds like.
However, with my Phasing Model, I feel it is easier for beginners to phase-shift into the region of their imagination first . Simply because I feel the action of doing that can be described more thoroughly, and each individual can create a mental rundown that suits them - rather than trying to follow any kind of rigid structure. Not that the Monroe model is rigid to start with, but still, I feel the ability for each individual to tailor their own rundown gives the Phasing Model the edge for beginners especially.
When you enter the 3D Blackness directly, you just enter the blackness. You tend to get a few swirling clouds of colour and some screen effects or texture effects maybe. I see these and get a feeling of forwards movement and there I am, slap-bang in the middle of the blackness. Well, that's what happens to me when I follow the traditional Monroe model.
However, in cases where you enter the 3D Blackness from "coming out" of an imaginative rundown: as the scenery of your imaginary scenario falls away, it feels like you are standing on some kind of a precipice. But if you enter the 3D Blackness directly, there is no imaginary scenery to fall away, as such. Though, if not a full rundown, there could be some kind of portal-effect created by the person in question that could give a similar sensation to what I'm about to describe. But if there is nothing to "fall away", then I can see that you would not likely come across the kind of precipice-effect that I describe.
The effect of a precipice comes about because, within your rundown, you feel as if you are within a solid kind of reality. And to all intents and purposes you are. Now, when the scenery of your rundown falls away to reveal the 3D Blackness, it feels like the only piece of solid ground that's left is the square foot or two that you are actually "standing on". Everything else just falls away and you often end up standing in mid air looking dumbstruck, at this amazing expanse of 3-dimensional nothingness in front of you.
To the person's mind, it also feels like "behind you" is where you just came from. This also reinforces the effect of standing on a precipice. It's quite a big thing just to allow yourself to float off into the blackness. Because you feel that if you take a step "forwards" or in a sense steps-off this tiny piece of solid ground the person feels they are standing on, then they are going to fall into a humongous black hole of nothing. This again serves to reinforce the precipice effect. Once a person becomes used to the scenery falling away, they will automatically allow themselves to float in the blackness and the sense of standing on a precipice will no longer be felt. Or at least it will not be anywhere near as acute an effect. But at first it can be quite daunting.
F4oC can be thought of an "umbrella" area and the other 3 areas are nested within that overall umbrella. Again, all in a manner of speaking. It is perfectly possible to "navigate" within an area. So you can be on the "edge" of F2, at the 3D Blackness, for example, and you may shift your perception and, as you do so, you will change your surroundings... but not necessarily change your actual area in consciousness. And this is an important fact that beginners must fully understand.
So you are at the 3D Blackness, say, so you shift your perception slightly and you could go and dwell within one of your belief constructs that you hold within F2oC. You could spend a whole session objectively viewing all manner of constructs and phase-shift back to F1oC. Or, if you became bored of dwelling within your subjective areas within F2oC, you could shift your perception once again back to the 3D Blackness. Then, you could phase-shift into F3oC and shift your perception around to begin navigating this area.
Beginners should please note here that you shift or change your perception in consciousness to navigate within a particular area of consciousness. But phase-shifting between different areas of consciousness is a different action. Basically, say London is F2 and New York is F3. You could be navigating your way around London. So you are shifting or changing your perception within London, and whatever you do, see or come across, you are still within London. Now hop on a plane to New York. This is like phase-shifting to another area in consciousness. So now you are shifting or changing your perception within New York, and whatever you do, see or come across, you are within New York. The important point I'm trying to get across is your scenery may be changing and you may be experiencing different events, but it does not necessarily follow that you have changed your area in consciousness.
Note: I also just want to say here, as I've mentioned before now and again, I'm a great fan of using the 3D Blackness as a kind of marker post that tells you where you are in the general scheme of things. From what you say, you are doing this automatically as you tend to use it as a kind of start point.
Problem is, as F2oC is so very fluid an environment, it's all too easy to become totally lost in what I call the "million meanderings". But when this happens simply shift your perception back to the 3D Blackness and, chances are, you'll right yourself. Not always, but a lot of the time.
It is also possible to shift your perception right "back" to Focus 12 of the Monroe model and I've even slipped into the real-time zone by shifting my perception "back" down the line from Focus 21. Not that there is a "line", as such. But with the Monroe linear-focus model you can think of it as shifting up and down the line, in a manner of speaking.
Yours,
Frank
#13 · Apr 19, 2005, 02:01 · Frank
You have hit on the very reason why I call it looking from a distance and that's what I am calling a third-person view. But I realise that my definition is not strictly correct. Technically, it can come across as not quite true third person, but more like actual first-person view but looking from a distance . With some people it can be a true third person, however.
Okay, regarding the sense question: let's choose a simple rundown. You are sitting at a table peeling potatoes.
Right, so you'll be lying in bed, aware of your physical body, yet in your mind you will be imagining there is another "you" who is sitting at a table peeling potatoes. Now, chances are this image will not be too clear at first. If you are like most people you will sense the image that you are creating, rather than actually see it. All you will likely be seeing is the blackness behind your closed eyes. So the image of this other "you" will be indistinct and hazy and none of it will make much sense.
Now, what we do is start to engage the senses of the "you" who you are creating in your imagination. Remember, your imagination is where you want to go to. Your imagination is situated within Focus 2 of consciousness. Once you are there, you can use F2oC as a launch-pad to get you to Focus 3 or Focus 4. Alternatively, you can stay within Focus 2 and have a nosy around, or you can come away towards the physical and have an RTZ experience. It's entirely up to you. But first you have to get yourself within Focus 2, and to do that we need to initiate "the switch".
So what you do is look at the table that you imagine this imaginary "you" is sitting at, see the wood it is made from, and feel the texture of it. In other words, engage the senses of the imaginary "you" sitting at that that table. It may not be a wooden table, it may be plastic. The detail is yours to decide and to imagine. You are not engaging the senses of your physical body lying on the bed. But the physical senses of the "you" who you are creating sitting at that table, in your mind. Doing that causes you to be more creative and shifts your focus of attention towards this imaginary person.
So you've felt the table and to the side of you is a bucket of potatoes and to the other side of you is another bucket with water in it. On the table is a peeling knife. What colour is the handle? See the colour, pick up the knife and feel it in the person's hand. Again, you are not feeling it with your own physical hand. The hand doing the feeling is the hand of the imaginary person you are creating in your mind.
Take one of the potatoes from the bucket and start to peel it. How does it smell, what sound does the knife make as it shaves-off the potato skin? When you have finished peeling then plop the potato in the bucket with the water. Did you hear the splash?
Are you getting what I mean now?
The idea is to create something not too elaborate, but not something so simple that you get bored and fall asleep or give up. Make it something that you enjoy doing, something simple that you can engage your senses, but make it a little repetitive so you can progressively build on the imagery, but not so repetitive that it become tedious and boring. In a rundown example published the other day, a member built a log cabin for himself. This kind of thing is ideal, because you have a series of repetitive actions but you are building something at the same time, which makes it far more interesting than merely doing some repetitive action on its own.
The more you practice this, the closer you will get to initiating "the switch". This happens when your focus of attention is captured by the imaginary imagery. You actually become the person you are imagining. Or you may end up in the same room as them and start talking to one another. This is kinda freaky when it first happens, lol, but you quickly get used to it.
Initially it's a little shocking, or at least it can be. Suddenly it'll be you sitting there peeling the potatoes within the same non-physical reality you were previously imagining from a distance. At which point you'll think, "Aagh, hang about, I'm not imagining this!" This realisation will tend to shock you out of the state. But after a few attempts you get used to it and you'll be able to remain where you are.
Once you are comfortable remaining in the state, then you can change your perception slightly and you'll see the current scenery give way to something else. Then you can practice doing this for a while. Don't try actually moving around. Just stand still and practice changing your perception and having your environment change to suit.
The BIG mistake people make is they immediately go flying off here and there. Unfortunately, doing that just creates havoc that can quickly get out of control, and all manner of misunderstandings can arise in your mind about the nature of the environment.
People tend to want to travel to places in the normal physical sense, so they set off walking, lol. But the secret to successful navigation of Focus 2 of consciousness, is realising you don't have to "travel" anywhere. You experience things by simply standing or sitting still and changing your perception. In other words, have your environment come to you rather than you trying to go to it.
Yours,
Frank
#14 · Apr 19, 2005, 13:23 · Frank
I'm reading what you say with interest.
The big temptation in the past has been to create a linear progression of levels or steps. I have subscribed to these kinds of notions in the past, mainly due to their convenience, but I can see no actual empirical evidence that would suggest these notions are in any way technically correct.
I'm trying to take great pains to point out that the Phasing Model is not a linear progression. We don't in any way "graduate" from F1 to F4 after successfully "achieving" F2 and F3. This is one of the reasons why, in my model, I have kept the separate-sounding states to an absolute minimum. Because the more there are, the more the temptation is to put them all in a line and think of them as a linear progression. Which is what people do with the Monroe model.
But saying that, the Monroe model does kinda check out as a linear progression. This is great for beginners. But then what happens is people think the linear-progression "idea" is how it is. Because it works that way, then that's how it must be... nope... that's not how it actually is. So the challenge then becomes (or at least it was for me) to create a model that does accurately reflect what is as opposed to what anyone thinks is.
I still do not have the terminology to describe accurately the interaction between the 4 primary areas of consciousness. I will, of course, take on board your comments regarding the Void state, or the 3D Blackness, and see if this area can be incorporated as a kind of mental focal point around which certain objectified elements of the underlying subjective activity can revolve (so to speak).
The concept of "revolving around" is a good one. After all, a large part of our reality revolves around one thing or another. But I'm not sure this concept could accurately be applied to the interaction between areas of consciousness. The archetype for the interaction in consciousness is held within Focus 4 (as are all archetypes). But it's one thing accessing them, so to speak, and quite another actually explaining them! Explaining this interaction is perhaps my biggest challenge at the moment and occupies most of my "projection time".
I hope to comment further in a little while.
Yours,
Frank
#15 · Apr 19, 2005, 14:28 · yhickfoe
Ive been reading a lot lately about phasing, and I am slightly confused, please could you clarify:
1. Can phasing be thought of the same thing as OBE or astral projection? It seems to me (from what I have read) that phasing is all concentrated within the imagination of the mind, whereas OBEs are actual 'coming out of your body' experiences (accompanied by exit effects and such).
2. From what I understand from the technique you lie in bed, close your eyes and try to picture a mental scene with you're minds eye, then incorporate your senses until you are actually in the scenario in 1st person? So at this point do you fly out of your body lying on the bed and go to where this scene is being created?
3. I have tried phasing but I can just 'think' of the scenario rather than create it and actually 'see' it. Then all I seem to do is end up falling asleep and dreaming, granted I remember the dream but im not 'lucid' so to speak. When phasing does one have full consiousness as in the physical?
4. As a beginner, I have had one OBE that I didnt really intend to do (i didnt induce the vibrations but I did the rest). That was about 2 weeks ago- where would you recommend I go from here? Not bother with trying to get vibrations and such and concentrate on phasing as a way to go 'out of body'?
Many thanks
#16 · Apr 19, 2005, 14:33 · Frank
And it's ultimately beyond my grasp too at present.
My ultimate dream is to create a mathematical model and be able to display this as an interactive graphical demonstration on a video. That would really be something, but it's at least 3 years away for me, at a guess. Problem is funding is always a burden. There are no juicy goverment grants available for this kind of, what they see as , way out and whacky theoretical work. But it would lay the foundations of our new way of thinking that is set to come.
Because that's what people don't have. They don't have that interactive model they can look at and play with on a computer screen. If they had that, then it would be the ultimate. It would just explain everything. All the old tosh would just become redundant.
We will formally acknowledge Focus 2 of consciouness (in addition to Focus 1 as people will see it then) in about 30 years or so. Then people will look back and realise where "us guys" were coming from. But it's getting people to realise that now that's the difficult bit. Of course, it doesn't help being incorporated in the same boat as every weird and whacky old and new "age" theorist that ever fought a devil or sucked a crystal, lol.
I'm dearly hoping to be able to form some kind of foundation to concentrate solely on research and to develop some computer models. If the book is a financial success then I'm hoping to plough the profits back into research. If I can produce something viable then, who knows, I may attract some kind of funding to take things further on a wider scale. Ha ha, dream on, Frank. It would be nice, though.
Yours,
Frank
#17 · Apr 19, 2005, 14:58 · Frank
You have to appreciate the fundamental difference between shifting or changing your perception in consciousness and actually changing your area of consciousness. The two are very different actions. Once you get a grasp of the way these two actions interact then perhaps some of the confusion you are feeling will dissipate.
The action of Phasing relates to an entirely different model of consciousness. The "astral" is, in fact, part of Focus 2 of consciousness of the Phasing Model. Within this area of consciousness you can objectively experience any belief construct you happen to hold, including that of "astral projection".
People who read all the books tend to be a bit obsessed with the "out of body" idea. I'm not into flying here and there myself. It just creates a lot of confusion. I've been there and done it, but nothing substantial ever really comes out of it. You end up having all kinds of whacky experiences, which is great... until the novelty wears off and you want to do something of real benefit... but you can't work out how.
Yours,
Frank
#18 · Apr 19, 2005, 15:59 · Danny
About how long does it take from the time you start visualizing your rundown until you make the switch? Now I know this can be influenced by a multitude of factors, and I guess I'm wondering how long it should take a beginner. Generally, should it be more like ten minutes or an hour?
Thanks,
Danny
#19 · Apr 19, 2005, 16:13 · mactombs
Quote I`m the least impressed with F2. Other people have demons. I have sharks and alligators. It`s not an area I plan to delve into much in the future, and in fact, like to stay out of as much as I can.You mean, you'd don't plan to delve much into it unless you're dreaming, eh?
I agree with you, though, other than as a launching point, I'm not very interested in this area, either.
Frank's rundown example with the potato peeling was a good read, and helpful. It answered some things I was wondering about rundowns, in particular what kind of activities are good for a rundown. Up until now, I'd just been generally sitting or walking in my rundown scenario, but my attention had been becoming increasingly difficult to sustain on this. Plus, the third-person first-person answers were helpful, too. Another post I think should be added to the Phasing FAQ!
Danny, it usually takes me more in the range of an hour or slightly more before I get near "the switch". I'm sure once I get more practice in, however, that it won't take as long. Just practicing relaxing is also good to do, and I have greatly decreased the time it takes me to do this ... I think it's important to realize, too, that you don't need to immediately engage in the rundown right off, but take some time to relax, let your mind calm from the day's activities, so that you don't become bored or tired with the rundown too early. It depends on how fast you relax.
#20 · Apr 19, 2005, 17:54 · Danny
So it takes you an hour. Thanks, that gives me a better idea what to expect. How long have you been practicing? Does it seen to happen faster as you practice more? For instance, how long did it take you when you first started versus now?
Thanks,
Danny
#21 · Apr 19, 2005, 18:34 · jilola
Quote Yes, what I had more or less is mind is circle divided as pie between F1, F2, F3. In the middle of the circle a smaller center as the 3D blackness.Doesn't that sound familiar of a caleidoscope? The 3D blackness tube being the tube( hee) and the different focii(Fn) as the different images you get by way of twisting the tube?
Now make the digram 3D, with the middle smaller circle (the void) going up as a tube. Also place an overarching dome on top of the circle as representing F4. It incorperates and overarches all focus levels.
That way...from the central 3D black tube all can be accessed at once: F1, F2, F3, F4.
It seems to me that any discreteness in the different consciousnesses is the result of subconsciously grafting on the discrete qualities of the focus we take for F1 (everyday perception).
There is one consciousness but any number of different perspectives(focuses) from which to perceive it. Like Frank said before in this thread, we don't have to move to change the surroundings, we can just change our perspective/perception and the surroundings wil change acccordingly. Twist the tube.
2cents & L&L
Jouni
#22 · Apr 19, 2005, 18:34 · mactombs
Yes, the process goes quite a bit faster now than before. Since I haven't been Phasing all that long, I can't give you any good numbers, but as far as reaching a trance or meditative state, before it took me almost two hours, and even then I'd easily be disturbed from it. I'm sure it would be different, though, if I'd started practicing Phasing right off the start instead. I really don't think with Phasing that it takes as long to see progress than it does in the more traditional methods.
#23 · Apr 19, 2005, 19:57 · Frank
F2 is alright I suppose, but I know what you mean. With me, it's just all a bit too self-fulfilling for my science-style research. Essentially, you go there and, whatever you believe you're right! And to the n'th degree too. There is nothing you can try and independently map, because whatever you think... is.
I do believe that computer modelling is definitely the way forward with this. I can see the whole thing now on an interactive DVD. That would be mind blowing. A multiple projection experience taken step by step with high resolution graphics and sound. There's just nothing else like it in the world.
I like Jouni's kaleidoscope idea too. That idea of twisting to represent a phase shift. Hmm, I'm going to think on that one.
Yours,
Frank
#24 · Apr 19, 2005, 23:52 · Frank
What I don't like about the place is the way it saps your focus. Like the physical captures it and F2 tries to sap all the acute energy out of it. If you are not careful everything just turns to jelly, as I think of it. Like it loses it's acuteness, then off you go wallowing in some lucid dream or any one of the other million meanderings.
But if you enter the region with a high degree of alertness and work to keep it, then you are okay (usually). But once you start losing it I feel it's better to step outside of the environment, rather than try to recapture your focus while within it. So that's again why the 3D Blackness can come in handy. We really do need a good name for the place, you know, unless everyone actually likes calling it the 3D Blackness.
Surely we can think of something more scientific. We can't call it the Void because that's too Dark Age mystical. We could get all poncified and call it The Region of Individual Conscious Hiatus, or the TROICH, lol. (You know how Monroe loved his acronyms.)
It also depends, I have found, what kind of constructs you are viewing. If it is something that would emotionally affect you in the physical, then it would be nigh on uncontrollable within F2. This is unfortunately what gets the ghost-train and the god bods.
It is interesting viewing all your different "layers" of conscious understanding. I particularly like dwelling within concepts I formulated in my youth. I chuckle at some of the structures I created when I was small. I was very creative as a child and had an incredibly vivid imagination. I still do, but it's a LOT more structured now.
Some of my early stuff really makes me chuckle. I'd give a few examples but it wouldn't actually mean anything to anyone as it's too personalised. Plus, it's something I feel more than it can be explained in words.
Yours,
Frank
#25 · Apr 20, 2005, 00:05 · Frank
Done right it shouldn't take you more than about 45 minutes. Individuals vary, of course, but I think trying for a continuous period of more than 45 minutes would start to become self-defeating. Half an hour every day is far better than a marathon 3.5 hour session one day a week.
Some people suggest that this kind of thing is best done at the same time every day, as your body learns to anticipate it and so forth. But in doing that you just end up curve-fitting yourself into a mental box. There's no sense in only being able to do it under some particularly exacting conditions. You want to create a degree of flexibility for yourself.
Generally you will find it easier if the physical is relaxed to start with. The relaxed and slightly dreamy state that comes about after coming awake from a number of hours of sleep is a good state to try in.
It generally takes me 15 to 30 minutes. Sometimes it can take up to an hour. But if I'm relaxed and in just the right mental frame of mind the switch to F2 from F1 can take just a few minutes.
Yours,
Frank
#26 · Apr 20, 2005, 00:54 · Andali27
I tried a mental rundown last night, one I was familiar with though I think I was trying to do too much at once and didn't get anywhere.
At some point though, I ended up in F12, though it was different from the F12 I was used to. The black space in front of my eyes took on depth and what I was looking at seemed a lot larger than it should have been. In fact, it had a lot of depth, but from there, I thought too much about it, couldn't concentrate on the rundown and ended up quitting for the night.
That morning, I woke at 5.30am and got up, had a drink, and went back to bed where I tried to go back to sleep.
I ended up thinking about my rundown but found myself in a dream where I was trying to sleep in a bed, in a room I've never been in before but someone came in, I know who but it didn't matter cause I was pretending to be asleep (in my dream), and as soon as they entered I started getting pre exit vibes. Though it was odd because I had vibes in my dream but they were transferring from the physical, the two kind of layered for a moment and I couldn't get a handle on what was going on though it was quite lucid as I recall trying to wake up and move but kept kind of rising into the air in the dream, not wanting it to happen in the dream and then I managed to wake up and realised I had had vibes in reality.
I rolled over and attempted to go back to sleep, only to realise it was going to happen again so I made myself uncomfortable to stop it. I didn't want to go RTZ that early in the morning.
From that I ended up in another non lucid dream that transferred to a lucid dream that was unbelievably vivid though I can't recall what it contained. All I know is that it seemed too real.
With vibes in dreams, I know I could have turned it into an experience but I had no intention to and kept trying to stop it, grabbing at the dream bed while floating away. That was accompanied with rising and falling feelings and a downward spiralling thing above me somewhere.
Sorry I can't be more specific as I was more focused on stopping it though I want to remember the lucid dream, OMG!!!! It just came to me! I did go RTZ! Holy c*rap, my heart is beating mega fast now.
I was trying to get somewhere in some other wherever, as part of the lucid dream, in a shopping centre I think. I was trying to fly but I was up near the roof and couldn't go forwards, something was forcing me backwards and I think it was that future wind thing Robert Bruce mentioned in his treatise. I ended up somewhere and somehow was shooting up into space towards the moon! Bell, damn it!
~*~*~ cont later.
I spent the whole first period of school freaking out! My pulse rate was right up and I thought I was shaking a couple of times.
I can't believe it! It didn't feel like part of the dream and I think somehow I RTZed from my dream! Into space! OMG! It was darker than what I imagined but I never made it to the moon but why the hell was I heading there in the first place? There was an unbelievable amount of distance I could feel behind me and I was going so fast then obviously lost energy or something and I forgot! Until I started writing this post sometimes this morning! I was all giddy and off centre for half the freaking day!
I haven't even made a decision to leave my room so how the hell did this happen? Gosh, every time I try something new I end up overshooting the mark by light years (pardon the pun).
I don't know if anyone can understand what the hell I'm thinking right now, I did it, and forgot and now the realisation of what I actually did is more than I can handle at one time.
Sorry for the language by the way, I'm kind of shaken but excited at the same time. Oh man, um, Frank, can you answer the questions I had before I went off on this tangent, how long should it take on average to expand to f2oC?
Sorry for the length, I think I'll take a break from this (focus states and such) for a week.
Andali
#27 · Apr 20, 2005, 11:03 · Danny
Quote from: Frank Danny:I agree, I don't want to do it at the same time every day. Even if it takes me longer initially I want the end result to be that I can do it anywhere/anytime. Obviously that will take a lot of practice but I really want to do it right.
Done right it shouldn't take you more than about 45 minutes. Individuals vary, of course, but I think trying for a continuous period of more than 45 minutes would start to become self-defeating. Half an hour every day is far better than a marathon 3.5 hour session one day a week.
Some people suggest that this kind of thing is best done at the same time every day, as your body learns to anticipate it and so forth. But in doing that you just end up curve-fitting yourself into a mental box. There's no sense in only being able to do it under some particularly exacting conditions. You want to create a degree of flexibility for yourself.
Generally you will find it easier if the physical is relaxed to start with. The relaxed and slightly dreamy state that comes about after coming awake from a number of hours of sleep is a good state to try in.
It generally takes me 15 to 30 minutes. Sometimes it can take up to an hour. But if I'm relaxed and in just the right mental frame of mind the switch to F2 from F1 can take just a few minutes.
Yours,
Frank
My main obstacle is that I'm chronically tired due to some energy/neg
related stuff I've been dealing with my whole life, that I just in the last couple of months really understood the scope of what was happening. With the help of a woman who does energy work I've pretty much taken care of it; I'm mostly just working on recovery now.
Once I've recovered fully this won't be a problem, but at the present I just want to sleep all the time and that's exactly what tends to happen when I practice phasing. I'm working through it though and like I said pretty soon it won't be a problem anymore.
Thanks for the info,
Danny
#28 · Apr 20, 2005, 13:00 · Frank
All the primary areas of consciousness are intertwined with each other. So you can easily have an RTZ projection from a dream or even an RTZ projection at the same time as being in a dream. Anyone who really wishes to confuse themselves should phase-shift into all 4 primary areas at the same time. Ha ha ha... a few times I managed to have an F1/F4 overlay. Now that is really freaky, lol.
When you talk about F12 and black space in front of your eyes taking on depth, this is the 3D Blackness at the Monroe focus 21 state. It's just that it does not necessarily have to come about as a profound experience. It usually does the first few times and then you get used to it. But for future reference, if you perceive a 3D Blackness then stop what you are doing and just allow that blackness to unfold and then mentally step into it.
Some people may begin the Noticing exercise, for example, and then after 10 minutes or so they may perceive the 3D Blackness. This may cause questions to arise such as, "Hang on, but I haven't even started my mental rundown yet, how come I'm at the 3D Blackness already?" It doesn't matter. It's just that most people don't find it quite so easy. In which case they have to take an additional step. They create a mental rundown, then step into the scene of that after making "the switch" and then they make the step to the 3D Blackness stage. But if someone can make the transition to the 3D Blackness in one go then so much the better.
At the later stage, when you were pretending to be asleep in the dream you were having and then you got vibrations, this was an F2/F1 overlay experience. In other words, your primary focus was the region of consciousness known as F2 and you were receiving input from your physical, which was F1 being overlaid upon your F2 experience.
People often have experiences they don't remember at the time but they do remember sometime later. This can be a little freaky and I understand your concerns. But next time try and be prepared to just roll with it and see what's offered. The optimum state is to be a passive observer and you release an air of mild curiosity. But I know very well how difficult that is to do in the beginning.
Within the F2 environment if your mind is racing, you tend to zoom off with it too. Like, you'll go shooting off into "space" at a million miles an hour and that kind of thing. Problem is it causes your mind to race even more so you just keep zooming about here and there. Next moment you are back in the physical wondering what the heck happened.
Many times I have had people say to me that they projected for the first time and they got really excited and then suddenly they got hit my this force of energy that caused them to zoom off. They ask me what is this mysterious force that they got hit by, is it a "neg" or something? Nope, it was just the force of their excitement. They released that energy within the F2 environment and whoosh; they zoomed off on their own sense of excitement.
Yours,
Frank
#29 · Apr 20, 2005, 13:17 · jilola
Quote Surely we can think of something more scientific. We can't call it the Void because that's too Dark Age mystical. We could get all poncified and call it The Region of Individual Conscious Hiatus, or the TROICH, lol. (You know how Monroe loved his acronyms.)Since the area appears to be a neutral perspective to consciousness from which the other areas/focuses can be reached you could take the caleidoscope metaphor a bit further and adopt the term Pivot Area to describe it.The 3D blackness seems to me to be a no-man's land of consciousness much like MT described with the segmented circle with the 3D blackness as the centre.
I think the belief structures and their effect on the perception of the consciousness focus fit the caleidoscopic metaphor nicely. They are what we use to perceive patters in the image and thus interpret the perception in terms of imagery and ideas based on the belief structures.
It's apparent that we experience what we expect to be there instead of what really is there.
2cents & L&L
Jouni
#30 · Apr 20, 2005, 14:08 · Danny
Just a suggestion from someone who really isn't qualified to give one yet.
Danny
#31 · Apr 20, 2005, 14:30 · Frank
Danny: anyone who has an input regardless of depth of experience should do so, as that's what we are all about here. The concept of F0 is actually a good one. Or at least I think so.
Jouni, I like that in the sense of not so much a pivotal area but a pivotal point. What you said yesterday really got me thinking as regards my computer model idea and your kaleidoscope analogy. There are a few points I want to make on the 3D Blackness and I'm hoping to find a spare hour later to write a short piece and publish to this thread.
Yours,
Frank
#32 · Apr 20, 2005, 14:36 · Makaveli
As for F2 I'm good at reaching it using the traditional AP but I haven't found my way to F3 or the 3d blackness yet. I'm starting to realize that my problem is that I get caught up in whatever F2 circumstances I find myself in then experience tends to degrade.
#33 · Apr 20, 2005, 14:37 · jilola
Quote I like that in the sense of not so much a pivotal area but a pivotal point."Point" was my first choice word for that but since I had in mind the experience of space I went with area. I guess the 3D is a point which we experience as a space.
2cents & L&L
Jouni
#34 · Apr 20, 2005, 14:57 · Danny
Danny
#35 · Apr 20, 2005, 16:30 · jilola
It is, after all, more like a ground state of consciousness than either a point or even an area. A physics analogue could well be the zero state energy field.
It's the reduced consciousness state that acts as a stepping stone or a pivot to other states, (read focuses of consciousness). The tripod for the telescope.
2cents & L&L
Jouni
#36 · Apr 20, 2005, 18:46 · Andali27
Anyway, Frank, how do you mentally move into the 3D blackness stage/F0 because I can't get past the edge of it. Mentally going forwards, I don't get it.
Andali
#37 · Apr 20, 2005, 20:56 · TheJza
I was reading a description by Bruce Moen where he says the feeling of going into the 3D Blackness is roughly the same feeling you get when you are looking at one of those "Magic Eye" stereogram illusions ( http://www.magiceye.com/ ) and it finally "clicks" and you see the 3D image. I bought one of the books and did it and I tend to agree with him that the feeling is similar.
#38 · Apr 20, 2005, 22:11 · knightlight
#39 · Apr 20, 2005, 22:20 · Frank
Look, I just had an idea (everyone dives for cover, he he):
How about taking the "zero" bit of the F-concept, and mixing it with what Jouni said about a Pivot Point? Let's call it P0. Now that would be sweet. So we start from point Zero, or head to point zero. That's quite good I reckon, calling the 3D Blackness Point Zero. So Point Zero becomes an internal reference point from which we phase-shift to other areas of consciousness. Ha ha, I like it already. Even though I realise I'm saying so myself at the minute, lol.
Yours,
Frank
#40 · Apr 20, 2005, 22:37 · Frank
Seriously, though, I always liked the idea of the 3D Blackness as an internal reference point and it does deserve some kind of label of its own. I never got around to the post I wanted to write on this point tonight as I've been working on my website and got entangled with that.
But what I wanted to say is the 3D Blackness is not a kind of common focus area, as such, it is a part of F2 so it's an individual thing. Everyone has their own 3D Blackness, so to speak. But it does appear to be something we do have in common and, because of the nature of the phenomenon, it is an area of 100% potential. So a start point, a pivot point or a point zero, which describes it perfectly.
So are we saying that Point Zero is the new 3D Blackness then?
Yours,
Frank
PS
Now don't change your minds will you otherwise it'll be another rewrite, lol.
#41 · Apr 21, 2005, 00:58 · Andali27
Hey, does anyone else besides me think we're like on the pioneering edge of this? I mean, now we're naming things like some scientist person would if he discovered a new planet (well, planet X isn't all that original) but we actually have a meaning behind this name and that's what counts!
Teamwork is what it's about people and Point Zero is so cool it makes me laugh, it sounds kinda sci-fi-ish. Although there's only one problem I see, people would have to get it right as P-0 not, PO as if people start calling it ("sounds like: oh!") instead of zero, than they may think we mean something else, point "p*iss off", P0. The reason I thought of it was because one of my friends said it, maybe. I like the name but if we had to think of an alternative, PZ perhaps?
Andali
#42 · Apr 21, 2005, 01:18 · Shzarnie
Shzarnie
#43 · Apr 21, 2005, 01:34 · redcatherine
Quote from: Shzarnie I've explained it all in the new member introductions.Welcome Again
Quote 1. My base chakra seems not to be doing anything when I try and activate them, what can I do to fix this?rather than focusing on activation of just the base chakra
i would suggest sitting in meditation and bringing up energy
as a white light
from the soles of your bare feet up your legs and into your pelvis .
and then thru the whole of the chakra column
Do this while you are sitting down
close your eyes
sit uncrossed and breathe deeply cleansingly 3 times
then breathe as you will
and dwell your consciousness in each chakra as you go up
feel
red apples red love hearts red roses red rubies
...all things bright and beautiful that are red .
This is btw a good place to visit but you would not want to live there would you ? It is the sex and food ...the lust and hunger spot ... feed me give me comfort.... now go away . lol
Go up from there to Orange.... make this chakra glow visually
home comfort monks in orange robes bliss sunsets dawns citrus apricots
you get the idea just sit and breathe and be that colour until you visualise it getting larger bigger shining vibrating fully all thru the rainbow of chakras
The violet chakra is the " i get my kicks above the waistline sunshine and a much nicer place to dwell. But when you get the energy flowing smoothly thru all your chakral column all of them will vibrate fully .
This is done by :
prayer
dreams and their analysis
astral projection while asleep
conscious projection while awake
healing self and others
teaching writing sharing
sharing energy in spiritual development circles
dedication to meditative practice
conscious development of the energy body .
Quote And, a few days ago, my brow chakra was active all day, it kept tickling me. I thought I had a hair on my forehead but whenever I went to brush it away, nothing was there. Why did this happen?This is your opening to clairsentience .
We develop in a continuum of feel it know it see it hear it .....
So
Go with this
it is a good sign
close eyes and sit in meditation when you feel this feathering
and see if you can learn who is with you
it will prolly be a guide or guardian angel at this stage
Quote 2. Does anyone know of a way to get the vibes? I can't seem to get any at all no matter how hard I try or don't try.The vibes is a male mojo method that Frank is most expert on.
I see he has given much thought to this thread already .
But you might ask him directly about this question 3
rather than on so many general ones to get his focus back
to the info you want
and read the FAQs search this AP site and google Robert Monroe
I myself do not spend time vibing up at all
i want to leave the body
so i ignore it
i place it in a comfortable position and go
i prefer to think non physical when i leave
so i slip out by will thru the heart or third eye chakra
this is a yin yang thing .
Men charge and explode out RED
Women intuit and will out INDIGO .
These are the balance of red electric and indigo magnetic . Either is fine just as we can bring energy up from the feet or down from the crown to meditate so we can exit the body in a number of ways too . But a balance is best .
Quote 3. And I don't really understand the f2oC, f3oC, f4oC, what are they, what do they do, and how do you get there?go out strongly as a male
come in intuitively as a female
seek the balance
learn to see while you project and to know what you are seeing
to concentrate only on energy body is to miss the sights the sounds
it is a way of groping in the darkness and getting the message
at the back of the mind and lower chakras
to go to higher realms go with in but stop at the heart no further down
this is the silver akasha the neutral the blend the balance of yin and yang
to go just up to see is a little airy fairy too
you get the feelings and the bliss but do you get the lesson and the gist
to just go up and go ahhh like a tourist is also not enough
it is the blending of light and sound in love that we seek
the male strength and hunger in the energy body
and the female passion and intuition in the third eye
Shiva teaches there are 3 lines of fire :
moon : goddess path within magnetic intuitive creative cold flying
sun : god path without electric destructive hot grounded
fire: in belly of the mystic as kundalini that rises to the heart
and ignites the anu flame of the silver akasha the heart chamber of Balance
13The Other side of the Cone of Consciousness Operation of Ley Lines of Infinity on the Grids and the Tunnels of Eternity
12Universal Mind Focus 34-35 is the locale having group consciousness
---Devic Chambers
---Human made spirit homes Focus 27: Afterlife free will resembling earth---Ashrams of other worlds ie Reptilians beyond the trajectory of Ursa Major
11Window on Edge of Universe
---Entrance to Hells for Students of the Occult
----Plane of Heavens Focus 24,25,26: Belief Territories of Afterlifers
---Human and Spirit cooperative Manifestations of Metaphysical Colleges
---Temples of Wisdom
---Gates of Death Focus 23: "stuck" confused unaware ghosts
10 Plane of Elementals , Devas ,Thrones , the Vortex , Elohim Council
---Human Manifestations ie ashrams of live humans
---Called the Pleaides lies on a trajectory off that star group in Taurus
---Called Sirius lies on a trajectory off this star Focus 21:edge of time/space - contact other energy systems.
9 Blue Lodge of what is called the Arcturians of Sirius
8 Group Monadic Soul - Meeting Higher Self
--Temple of Zodiac and Great Clock Focus 15: State of no time
7 Logoic -Shamballah --Temples of Light
---Ashrams of Chohans Great Pyramid
6 Golden Chamber of Melchiezedek
5 Monadic- work with guides , mahatma , chohans and archangels
-- Astral Hall of Learning – Spiritual King's Chamber over Luxor - Focus 12: A state of expanded awareness
4 Astral Lower Focus 10: Mind Awake/Body Asleep
3 Physical Focus 3: increased mental coherency and balance
2 Totem Earth Wisdom
1 Lower Plane of Chaos and "Hell on Earth "
#44 · Apr 21, 2005, 10:41 · Danny
Plus, like Andali27 said, being the result of group effort makes it that much cooler.
Danny
#45 · Apr 21, 2005, 11:01 · Scorpyn
#46 · Apr 21, 2005, 11:32 · Danny
Just some random info that popped in my head.
Danny
#47 · Apr 21, 2005, 14:10 · jilola
The term Event Horizon describes the boundary where the escape velocity equals the speed of light. The point a particle falls to is the center of gravity but the observable movement appears to stop at the even horizon.
2cents & L&L
Jouni
#48 · Apr 21, 2005, 14:47 · Frank
Yours,
Frank
#49 · Apr 21, 2005, 15:05 · jilola
2cents & L&L
jouni
#50 · Apr 21, 2005, 15:14 · Danny
Danny
#51 · Apr 21, 2005, 15:28 · knightlight
#52 · Apr 21, 2005, 18:53 · Andali27
Zero Point is also another stargate term, though there's an M on the end and funnily enough it stands for 'zero point module' it's a device with a heckavalot of power in it that allows the stargate to dial 8 chevrons instead of the usual seven, contacting a wormhole in another galaxy. It's actually an Ancients device they used to power their city, Atlantis, which in the show, never came from earth, if you've seen the show, help me out!
But yeah, I like PZero or PZ and even ZeroPoint, ZP, but does it matter if it ends up being a name already used? ZPEH? Zero Point Event Horizon, though as jilola said EH isn't really fitting.
I think PZ or ZP, IMO, what'd you all think?
Andali
#53 · Apr 21, 2005, 20:10 · Frank
I'm not a fan of anything that implies a "source" as the 3D blackness is most definitely not a source. Focus 4 of consciousness contains all the archetypes, so there's the source of all that is within the other 3 areas.
The 3D Blackness is a kind of handy starting point, a sign that people can recognise, that kind of thing. A kind of Point Zero or Point Zed he he, I do like it! No longer will I have to type "3D Blackness" a hundred times a month, lol. It's just PZ, great.
Yours,
Frank
#54 · Apr 22, 2005, 13:40 · redcatherine
Quote from: Shzarnie I asked this before, how do you move "mentally" into F0 because whenever I actually try, I still sit on the edge, watching like in a movie theatre and can't get "into it". Whats the mental movement/rundown you can conjure up to cause yourself to move forwards without moving physically?ShzarnieI think the thread has taken on a life of its own
and it has come way off topic lol
and they have forgotten what it is you asked
in the beginning
and again now
I think they are ignoring you as author of this thread and your questions
and engaging in some other topic
Perhaps you should start another thread
over in Spiritual Development
as they are all rambling on about what to call darkness while projecting .
I have an idea :
How about "the back of the eyelids"
Sorry , Just having a laugh
Vishnu says
when people act
immaturely
in anger
and
without love
do not react to them and gain karma
just laugh at them instead .
Sorry just me butting in being a complete idiot as usual .
( C'est Drole )
np ... keep your insert.......I won't delete it . ....I did not actually write the green line .In fact when i submitted this post I got an error message and the post did not appear ...Thinking it had gone to cyberspace i went to sleep and thought nevermind as it was nearly 2 am here in Perth ... It is disappointing that some feel the need to write off topic ignore the thread and then insert diatribe.hmmmm What has happened to the integrity of the forum
I suggest you start eating soup .The energy is higher in soup making it much easier to project. Once you learn, you can drink it alone if you wish or drink soup concurrently, in an open circle,and in a closed circle .
Soup work also allows you to see and hear more of the OBE . The guides and angels of others in the soup work together as a team making it easier for newbies to get the energy up to slip out. Find a group near you thru a soup church or coven .
Or make a soup of your own to serve at home . Choose only those that can prove they already like your soup and that you can get along with. Sit sipping soup weekly for an hour . 7 : 30 pm is a good time to meet . 5 to 12 people is a good soup group . Here is a link on how to form a soup development circle :
http://www.isd-dc-soup.org/ISD-Wash/ SOUP _EDUCATION/CONTENT%20S oup Development%20 Soup Circles.htm
If soup- groups can not be had or you are a solo, soup -sipping kind
#55 · Apr 23, 2005, 12:57 · redcatherine
onions : ignore them they stink and burn your eyes
salt : don't use it - it hurts when you rub it in your wounds
water : use lots -like time , it dilutes anything
chicken : is good for the soul and most bullies are good for pounds of it
bones : don't bother picking them ,just toss them in and leave them alone
#56 · Apr 23, 2005, 13:26 · Danny
Also, your soup posts ( redcatherine ) totally confused me.
Danny
#57 · Apr 23, 2005, 13:37 · Frank
I'm sorry but this thread has gone a little weird at the end. We had a good discussion and came to some interesting conclusions. Naturally, I am grateful for having had the opportunity of interacting with all who contributed, but it's gone a bit loopy.
I'm gonna lock the thread here for the online safety of the member currently having probems, and try to sort out what that problem is, exactly.
Okay, so let's quit while we're ahead. Thanks for your contributions. We actually made a little history, I reckon, with our decision regarding FZ. Here's to the next time folks!
Yours,
Frank
PS
Major Tom,
We just cross-posted, sorry for any confusion.